"Up to you" (The endless realm of possibilities!)

[tomscam]

I met a LB during my last trip to LOS in December. I was there for 5 weeks and in that time I spent about 3 of them with her. We got on great and I probably had the best trip that I've ever had in LOS. Since arriving back in Australia we've keep in touch via MSN and Skype almost daily and I'm keen to pursue things further with this one.

A couple of other things: she doesn't work in the biz and there's 9 years between us.

My issue: I'm keen to move over to LOS to work and be with her but when I question her about possible arrangements she keeps answering "up to you?". I'm a straight up kind of guy so this answer doesn't really cut it for me. I'm not really sure what to make of this or if I'm looking into to this too much. My problem is that I never seem to get a conclusive answer from her and therefore I'm unsure how to move next.

Any theories about "up to you"?

[guydesavoy]

If she is the only reason to move and live and work there, then you'd better have a plan 'B'.

"Up to you" is legendary and one could write a thesis.... Short answer : Maybe she is shy, maybe doesn't want to commit, maybe she is waiting/testing to see how serious you really are, or maybe she doesn't care either way.

If you really want to make this move for her, then one way or another you're going to have to spell it out and get a straight answer..

[Naang Faa]

Agree with that..

Up to you is just Thai ambivalence..

Weather it a lack of communication in a language barrier or whatever..but i
find that if a Thai wants you to know something they will spend hours on end
talking to you until you understand..
x

[Tomcat]

If you keep in touch daily then there must be something there surely.
also , how do you keep- in- touch guys keep a conversation up every day..what do you talk about. Just curious...

I never been one for the chitter chatter other than the odd occasion with a hottie in the PI.

good luck Tomscam I hope it works out

[Rocket J. Squirrel]

(Naang Faa @ Mar. 24 2010,21:12)  Up to you is just Thai ambivalence..

 Weather it a lack of communication in a language barrier or whatever..but i
find that if a Thai wants you to know something they will spend hours on end
talking to you until you understand..

Very well stated.

[celentano]

maybe you are not the only one Farang she keep in touch?
you said, she don't work in scene?
Do she work in other place? On islands or BKK or Pattaya?
Office Job or Shopping Mall or Hairdresser?
If she not work, from where she have the money?
Maybe her dad is rich? Okay..
Is she a freelancer? Or maybe a Escort Girl?
Maybe she have a sponsor who care her?
She said up to you in this situation because she don't really want
stay together with a man, because she don't want have trouble with her sponsor?
Maybe her sponsor is a good guy who let her a lot of space for
go sometimes with other men..Maybe she like this, have a sponsor outside Thailand who accept her so? If she try to stay with you she do broke her
"relation" with her sponsor..
what is if she not happy with you then?
If the relation with you not work well, she loose her sponsor too.. Do she really want this?

Many questions, i hope finally for you that she is a good girl and will make you happy for long time..  

[manarak]

My issue: I'm keen to move over to LOS to work and be with her

Separate the two things.

1- You are keen to move to the LOS to work.

2- You are keen to be with her in the LOS.

Check if you would do #1 without number 2.
Try supplementing #2 with "or with any other LB I fancy"

Personally, I interpret the "up to you" as she being available for long term arrangements (for $$$).

[tomscam]

Cheers for the replies people.

I think that spelling it out and trying to get a definite answer is my only option. I am keen to move to LOS but the motivation for doing it now is to be with her. She lives in BKK and I've tried to suss out whether she'd live in any other locations in LOS but all I've been getting is "I don't know".

She is an introverted and shy girl, not pushy in any way. I have come to develop some strong feelings for her and really want to try and have a go at a future together. I think that her line of answering is probably indecisiveness and also probably testing to see if I'm serious about this or not. I realize that these girls often get bullshitted by guys (farang and Thai) quite a bit so maybe its a protection mechanism.

Still, "up to you" is starting to test my strength. Ambivalence is not a good ingredient for a relationship I would have thought.

[whore]

So you spent 3 weeks with a ladyboy on your last trip just 3 months ago, and now your planning on moving to Thailand to be with her.

SNAP OUT OF IT MAN!!!!

How do you know she doesnt work? If she told you herself then it must be true. You say she is shy, how many guys here have barfined a shy girl from Nana plaza? Where did you meet her? If you met her online then she cant be working, although there are alot of thai ladyboys who work online and social networking sites are there stage in cascades. How many times have we seen guys here fucking ladyboys from make up counters, 7elevens, salons etc.

If your seriously going to move to Thailand dont do it for a ladyboy. Do it for yourself man and only do it if you know you will be able to have a good life financially or have a decent job.

[daveduke007]

(Tomcat @ Mar. 24 2010,18:11) also , how do you keep- in- touch guys keep a conversation up every day..what do you talk about. Just curious...


good luck Tomscam   I hope it works out

How is the weather?, how is your work?, what you do today? did you eat lunch yet?, how is your family? etc is a norm

I do talk to my girl Daily after shes finished work at the Hospital and it is really surprising how many numerous and different things you do actually chat about and for how much time you spend doing, especially at weekends when shes off work  

I also get the "Up to you" sketch sometimes as she says if Im happy then she is happy.  

Tom, I take the girl your refering too is the one I met you with in Phuket    

If so mate, Im with TC wishing you "chok dee" and hope it all goes well for you  , shes a good un

I do think with your qualications you wont have a problem getting work in BKK or any other parts of  , but if it does all goes "pear" then you can always return home.

And your worried about the 9 years difference between you?   , as I remember rightly you are a good looking 29 year old geezer ( no, I dont fancy you pal   )

Jeez Tom, my lass is 25 and I hit the 49 button in a couple of weeks   but she still "lubs" me  

Hope we get together for a few beers soon in the future buddy, it was a great pleasure meeting you  

[Chinaman]

As 4 China, and that is with people of yr social level (professionals, no p4p, etc.) "up to you" is supposed to give the other person face by letting him/her decide. Perhaps it is very similar in Thailand but in the p4p scene it been moved to a different level - I want to see what you will do for me, basically.

Yes, you have fallen in love because you have experienced sth you have never experienced before perhaps - I did the first time I went to Thailand back in 2002 and I still do, although much less regularly.

In general too many up-to-yous and I-don't-knows will snap you out of it very quickly once you really lived here/there. So, it is time to find out as much about this girl you can - from her! Ask here about her life, her family, etc. If she feels the same, she will open up - or she might not. The more that is kept back, the more careful you should be. Just figure that you are navigating in waters you do not know and you are not aware of the rules.

Before burning your bridges, come for another holiday or 2 and things might look very differently. If they don't, you can still decide.

At least, a 9 year age diff is not a big problem, but you need to get to know her much better. If she is from a good family, you might have a very hard time getting into a serious relationship with her. If she is not, you might find that part easier but you need to protect yr assets b4 jumping into this head over heel.

As Manarak said it - separate the two issues.

I know there are things I said, others might find untrue or partly untrue or contradictable - no problem, just my POV.

[pacman]

I agree with Chinaman & I will add a few thoughts of my own.

A 20 yo LB who has never worked P4P knows nothing about farangs except for the misconceptions of her family & friends.

She may have met a few through her work or elsewhere but to the average Thai we are a creature of myth & wonderment.

I know that is a generalisation but so many of them just don't follow our mindset. As we don't get theirs.

The next thing is you may be expecting too much from a young sheltered LB. To expect her to have hard & fast opinions when she has grown up in a society that demands her to be forever placating her peers for fear of causing them loss of face, it is not an environment where youngsters grow up knowing their own mind.

It has always been part of the conversation since I first visited - "what do you want to do?"  Up to you. "are you hungry? Shall we go eat?" Up to you. Etc, etc...

In the end you learn to reverse the tables - "I am going to eat. If you want to come, up to you", "I want to go to movie. Up to you if you come or not."

You are not acting in a way she understands. By being overadaptive, you are sowing the seeds of your own disaster. A Thai man would lay down the rules (another generalisation I know) but she would be more comfortable being told what to do than having to take the initiative.

Try changing tact, ask her something, then ask "you like or not like?" I have found this could often get to the heart of a problem. A little voice saying "I don't like" can explain much more than that inoffensive but meaningless term "up to you".

Once you are in a relationship, no doubt she will change & assert her self but right now, you are someone she is constantly trying to second-guess so she doesn't cause offence.

And don't sell up & move without taking her for another holiday. She is either that one in a thousand who is marriage material or you will start to see the cracks. Remember love is blind.

[azza33]

More pictures and less writing please!! It's hurting my brain

[Bumpa STIKKA]

Some great advice on this thread...

[tomscam]

(whore @ Mar. 25 2010,09:09) So you spent 3 weeks with a ladyboy on your last trip just 3 months ago, and now your planning on moving to Thailand to be with her.

SNAP OUT OF IT MAN!!!!

How do you know she doesnt work? If she told you herself then it must be true. You say she is shy, how many guys here have barfined a shy girl from Nana plaza? Where did you meet her? If you met her online then she cant be working, although there are alot of thai ladyboys who work online and social networking sites are there stage in cascades. How many times have we seen guys here fucking ladyboys from make up counters, 7elevens, salons etc.

If your seriously going to move to Thailand dont do it for a ladyboy. Do it for yourself man and only do it if you know you will be able to have a good life financially or have a decent job.

Everyone who has posted has given some great advice. Something I was looking for to help give me a different perspective on things. Sometimes it's difficult to look outside the square when you are the square.


Cheers for the advice Whore.

I understand your perspective but I really haven't given too much personal info because I didn't want to give too much away. Not online in a public forum anyway.

I know that hanging out with someone for three weeks isn't a long time but I've probably been chatting online with her for about six months. She was working in an office but has now quit this job and is unemployed. She's told me she is looking for another job, hopefully one she enjoys.

I have been looking into moving to LOS for quite a while now but I guess meeting her has become the impetus for me to pull my finger out and do it. I realise that things mightn't work out if I go there but if you worry about failure and stop oneself from having a go, then you will never enjoy success.

I believe that I could get a job there without too many worries and if it all does fuck up then back to Oz I go.


I guess my real issue is the indecisiveness on her part. I want to know if she wants me to be there with her and give this a go. I want definite answers.